mens rights

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

RE: mens rights

zap · texaschickeee translator

That cuts both ways you know....and from some of your other posts, I don't think you are too interested in what God thinks......

And just because YOU like the system because it is messed up in YOUR FAVOR...does NOT mean it should not be changed.

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

Are you saying the system is screwed up in MY favor cause I am female? Cause like I said, I don't deal with the system. Because I know how fucked up it is. I didn't chase down my ex and ask for child support. But he better not try to come around and act like he has a say so either.

zap · texaschickeee translator

Yes. That is what I am saying, and I am not the only one saying it either.

You did do the right thing. I think your kid is much better off because you did do the right thing. However, I am reluctant to say he does not have a responsibility. From what you said, it was agreed that he wanted nothing to do with the child, and you agreed. And, rather than trying to hold him responsible for support...you choose instead to cut him completely out of the child's (and your) life. I think that is a fair trade.

On the other side however, if he was being forced to pay support....you should not be allowed to cut him out, or have superior rights in addition. IMnotsoHO

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

zap wrote:

Yes. That is what I am saying, and I am not the only one saying it either.

To be honest Zap, I could care less who the system favors, I don't deal with it. I feel for the men paying for their lazyass ex wives. I never once said I condone that. It's people like that, that give women a bad name.

if he was being forced to pay support....you should not be allowed to cut him out, or have superior rights in addition. IMnotsoHO

I totally agree. I just think the court case in question will lose. That was really my point from the beginning.Do I think it's fair? NO. But I don't think it's fair to give control to the man. And i don't think that a good enough system for equal rights will ever be made. Period.

-- Edited by Badmofo at 16:43, 2006-03-10

zap · texaschickeee translator

Badmofo wrote:

To be honest Zap, I could care less who the system favors, I don't deal with it. I feel for the men paying for their lazyass ex wives. I never once said I condone that. It's people like that, that give women a bad name

Well again....it is because you chose the high road in your situation. And I was unclear on your standing on the lazy ex issue.

I totally agree. I just think the court case in question will lose. That was really my point from the beginning.Do I think it's fair? NO. But I don't think it's fair to give control to the man. And i don't think that a good enough system for equal rights will ever be made. Period

Now...if you are just saying you think this particular case will loose...I agree. It most likely will. BUT....my issue was that it should NOT loose.

You keep saying that it is not fair "to give control to the man" yet you insist that the woman should have all control.... doesn't that sound a little lopsided to you? Especially when in MOST cases (even if YOUR case is an exception) the guy just gets thrown under the bus for being the guy?

If no one tries....there will certainly never be a fair system will there?

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

Yes i think it's lopsided cause it has to be. This better system you speak of is not at the top of out governments list but , hey, good luck. I hope it works out for you men. But it has to be one or the other right now and I think it should be the woman. Now that is not every case cause I have seen some women who didn't need to be having kids.

I am not trying to bash your hopes of a better system, just lookin at the bigger picture. The government could obviously care less what you men think of it's system, And if someone can create a fair system based on a case to case basis, I applaud them. But that is a lot of time and resources that I think could be spent somewhere else.

-- Edited by Badmofo at 17:23, 2006-03-10

kansas · Stinky

Seems like a rather silly suit. If you don't want to be an "unplanned father" then either don't have sex or make sure you take care of the precautions. If you dumb enough to believe "I swear I can't get pregnant or I am on the pill" and you proceed, then well, buyer beware. Believe it or not, men actually have the right to say NO to sex also, ever think about that?

zap · texaschickeee translator

8) I think I mentioned that a couple pages back when I said BOTH participants are EQUALLY and seperately responsible for the results.

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

It all comes down to prevention and education. If we can get a little of that then we will have less of these bogus ass court cases.

kansas · Stinky

Well technically according to the Law of Woman, everything is actually the mans fault.

zap · texaschickeee translator

kansas wrote:

Well technically according to the Law of Woman, everything is actually the mans fault.

Yes...I think we have conclusively proven that today...

zap · texaschickeee translator

Badmofo wrote:

It all comes down to prevention and education. If we can get a little of that then we will have less of these bogus ass court cases.

Why would a case asking for FAIR TREATMENT be "bogus ass"??

(no need to answer....we can all see quite clearly thank you)

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

Feit's organization has been trying since the early 1990s to pursue such a lawsuit, and finally found a suitable plaintiff in Matt Dubay of Saginaw, Mich.
Yeah I wonder how many they went through to find this case? Reason being it is a bogus ass argument.

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

you're welcome

-- Edited by Badmofo at 18:27, 2006-03-10

KatScratch · Bad kitty....in the best possible way

zap wrote:

KatScratch wrote: There's a big difference between responsibilities and paying a woman to sit at home and pay her rent & utilities for her all in the name of child support! It's not a woman's right to get child support just because she can.... The "concept" of it may have been a good idea, but the way it has actually worked is totally fucked up! That is an all to familar picture of a woman who not only was not responsible, but also continues to choose not to be

No you are wrong Zap, this was not an example of an irresponsible woman at all...it IS how truly fucked up the child support system is to allow such shit to happen in the first place! No one woman designed the system and not all women exploit the system. The system takes advantage of an idea and twists people (and children's) lives to get their cut. It's a crock of shit!

KatScratch · Bad kitty....in the best possible way

FYI....Just because a man donates sperm, it doesn't mean he is a father. There's a lot more to it. And the same goes for a woman....giving birth doesn't make a woman a mother! Parenting is a lot more than just the act of creation.

All this case is hoping for is the "debate" to hit the open floor of the people. To maybe make people see that there is more to child rearing than money! And that the money part of the system is really screwed up!

It takes 2 to get pregnant....ladies, if you didn't SEE the condom go on...dah...no brainer here....know you got your own ass covered against pregnancy before you ever get to the bedroom! Hell, hand him a dam condom, don't people even check anymore???? There are diseases, not just pregnancy.....Blame it on the man????? Who the fuck???? It is YOUR BODY ladies, protect it yourself! (fifth grade sex ed)

zap · texaschickeee translator

Yeah...but if there were not "more than a few" gals whining with their hands out....the system would not have become so screwed up in the first place now would it.

KatScratch · Bad kitty....in the best possible way

that statement lost my respect for anything intelligent you may have said before....that's just bitterness twisted on your own experiences! *shakin my head*....And you were doing so good????? LOL

zap · texaschickeee translator

KatScratch wrote:

that statement lost my respect for anything intelligent you may have said before....that's just bitterness twisted on your own experiences! *shakin my head*....And you were doing so good????? LOL

And you were doing sooooo well before you said something stupid like that! *shakinhishead*

No...my arguments are not at all based on my own experiences...and those were not bitter comments. That comment takes into account the prevailing opinion that everything is the guy's fault and only "dads" can be deadbeats.

Besides....it does not change ANYthing I said before now does it?

texaschickeee · Seductively Sassy

Badmofo wrote:

. Adoption is great, but who wants to carry a child for 10 months just to give it away?

I was adopted at birth, before there was open adoption.

Im grateful not to have been aborted. Im even more grateful for the women whom gave me life gave me a chance to live a life that I would have NEVER HAD with her.

Both my brother and I were adopted the same way. I ahve no reason to look her up but he choose to. who whats to carry a child for 9 months to give them up, a selfless, loving women who loves that child regardless of how that child was made.

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

texaschickeee wrote:

who whats to carry a child for 9 months to give them up, a selfless, loving women who loves that child regardless of how that child was made.

I didn't mean carry it and keep it cause you carried it. See, you don't have kids tc or you would have understood that. You grow attached to a fetus inside you after 10 months. I could never give up something that was a part of me that long.

zap · texaschickeee translator

damn...I guess gals that haven't given birth are just guys without dicks huh?

<shrug> we're both wrong right?

KatScratch · Bad kitty....in the best possible way

zap wrote:

KatScratch wrote: that statement lost my respect for anything intelligent you may have said before....that's just bitterness twisted on your own experiences! *shakin my head*....And you were doing so good????? LOL And you were doing sooooo well before you said something stupid like that! *shakinhishead* No...my arguments are not at all based on my own experiences...and those were not bitter comments.

"Yeah...but if there were not "more than a few" gals whining with their hands out....the system would not have become so screwed up in the first place now would it." You don't consider that a bitter comment.....please!

That comment takes into account the prevailing opinion that everything is the guy's fault and only "dads" can be deadbeats. That comment just took your aruement/debate and turned it into a finger pointing contest....I agree with the concept that men are getting the blame for something wrongly, but turning that pointed finger doesn't make you any better than the femi-natzies that point it at the men!

Besides....it does not change ANYthing I said before now does it? But it does take away from the open mindedness and non-childish concept of your previous statements????

-- Edited by KatScratch at 20:51, 2006-03-10

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

zap wrote:

damn...I guess gals that haven't given birth are just guys without dicks huh?
<shrug> we're both wrong right?

Ummmm excuse me. I pointed out no wrong doing or anything. Do you need glasses? She thought I meant something I didn't and I was just clarifying.

texaschickeee · Seductively Sassy

your right I dont.

I got attached to my friends kids while she was preggers.

I got attached to my nephews while they were still in the womb.

My staement was a women that loves her child enought to give it a better life then she could. Not every women could do that.

example.... my brothers birth mother got pregant at 16 with him. this was in 1968. She gave him up to give him a chance to habvve life she as a very young person herself could not give him. that is what I menat by a selfless person.

myself, from the info I have... My mother was 23 and a sercatary. She got preganat in 1970 and went froim califorina to texas and gave birth. my b day is 11-29. my parents were in pota rico (spel) when I was born and thy brought me home 12-8. she gave me up to give me a better life. I dont know it I was a produvt of a one night stand, a couple that never went beyond tht or what. And I personlly dont have a need in myself to look her up (i would like medical info and I could get tht if i wanted it bad enough) but thts what I ment. I understand totally that some people can not give a part of them selves away. my statement is and was that it takes a selfless perosn to do tht.

KatScratch · Bad kitty....in the best possible way

Badmofo wrote:

texaschickeee wrote: who whats to carry a child for 9 months to give them up, a selfless, loving women who loves that child regardless of how that child was made. I didn't mean carry it and keep it cause you carried it. See, you don't have kids tc or you would have understood that. You grow attached to a fetus inside you after 10 months. I could never give up something that was a part of me that long.

Not all women are you Badmofo....some women never get attatched....that's why babies end up in dumpsters or abandoned in hospitals....and the lucky ones get adopted by loving families. Just because a woman gets pregnant doesn't mean she feels what you feel being a mother....there are many women who have given up their children rather than be a parent. They couldn't bring themselves to abort the child, so they gave it life and a chance for a life through adoption.....

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

I kinda understood that. Damnit tc, I am gonna teach you how to use commas. They help. But anyway. Yes, if I had known in some way I couldn't provide for my first child,being young and all(20), I would have given him up. For his sake.

Plush · Make believe Slutty Zombie/Official TOP Drama Queen

KatScratch wrote:

Badmofo wrote:
texaschickeee wrote: who whats to carry a child for 9 months to give them up, a selfless, loving women who loves that child regardless of how that child was made. I didn't mean carry it and keep it cause you carried it. See, you don't have kids tc or you would have understood that. You grow attached to a fetus inside you after 10 months. I could never give up something that was a part of me that long.
Not all women are you Badmofo....some women never get attatched....that's why babies end up in dumpsters or abandoned in hospitals....and the lucky ones get adopted by loving families. Just because a woman gets pregnant doesn't mean she feels what you feel being a mother....there are many women who have given up their children rather than be a parent. They couldn't bring themselves to abort the child, so they gave it life and a chance for a life through adoption.....

I know.

eltsacon · I have seen USofA's big balls

Texaschickeee “I was adopted at birth, before there was open adoption.

Im grateful not to have been aborted. Im even more grateful for the women whom gave me life gave me a chance to live a life that I would have NEVER HAD with her.

Both my brother and I were adopted the same way. I have no reason to look her up but he choose to. who wants to carry a child for 9 months to give them up, a selfless, loving women who loves that child regardless of how that child was made.”

Wow. That is more then just an opinion. I have to tell you texas, you just got my respect! blow’s the “fetus” mentality out the fucking window!

KAT – Don’t know, I’m not sure I agree with your take on Zap’s “bitterness”. To be honest, that conclusion he came up with is the end result of what we have once if you shave all the horseshit off of it. “Yeah...but if there were not "more than a few" gals whining with their hands out....the system would not have become so screwed up in the first place now would it.” –Is a true statement as long as everyone still bitched about it. Though you are right, it’s all about the governments cut. I too believe the government has used the simple, lazy, self-centered, I’m entitled, selfish woman mentality to make a buck.

ZAP – “Not at all. Being intellectually dishonest is totally different than being dishonest for voicing your opinion.

In my opinion, if you can see the logic of a point, yet argue against it simply because it is not in your favor...I think that is being intellectually dishonest.”

That is the truest statement said on this thread, or any thread I have read on this site!!!!!!! AND, it also happens to be the #1 problem in all area’s from what I have learned!!!!! That fucking statement would get you elected in my book dude!!!

MOFO- ok, no one can be that out right stupid! Your telling me that logic actually works in your head somehow. You don’t see the huge amount of flaws in your reasoning? I have to ask, what the fuck happened to you that gave you such a hate, or hurt, to where your world of logic on this has been knocked so far off it’s axis? It’s the only thing that can explain it. HELL, even women are posting that your ideology is pretty fucked up!!! I mean the only thing you have said that made me think is when you basically said, (men should take precautions because you can’t trust a woman when they say they can’t get preg, or are on the pill.) Well, after the rest of what you’ve said, I can see why trusting a woman may in fact be dangerous! Sorry to do a drip spat on you but good god woman, you need to think it through!

-- Edited by eltsacon at 00:23, 2006-03-11